bigsteve Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 I was driving happily along to work in a Monday morning daze and caught glimpse of one of those pesky roadside mobile 'Safety Camera' Vans a bit too late. I'm hoping I wasn't speeding enough to warrant a ticket (probs no more than 5-7 mph over) and I was in the offside lane so I'm hoping the cars in the nearside blocked its view. But, if they do decide that my clean license is to be adorned with 3 points for stupidity, has anyone any idea how long it might be before I come home from work and realise I have to empty my bank account of £60? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 (edited) LOLOLOL could be up to six weeks I think, lolol shouldn't have been speeding. I was done for speeding once, I was doing 120 mph in a 60 zone, at 2am (it was clear and straight and dry(no excuse tho)) and I slowed down as I came up behind a very very slow car, I overtook it at 90, it followed me, so I sped away round corner after corner but each time it kept up behind me, even thru coned off high street roadworks, like playing a computer game, they were still in the rear view mirror. I thought they were gonna give me a kicking so it was only at a red light I stopped and yes the blue lights under the grill of their car came on. Stupid thing was I had never speeded before I just wanted to have a go at it. Learned my lesson anyway. That was ages ago now. I never drive too fast now, I know too much about the crap that happens in the world, I worry too much about everything, and the roads are near top of my list. Edited November 10, 2008 by Number 2 fan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsteve Posted November 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Yep, I realise it isn't big nor clever. I was done at 4.30 in the morning many years ago doing 54 in a 40. Normally I wouldn't have been speeding, but I had a courtesy car and was giving it some, like you do when its not your own car. Even if I don't get a ticket, its slowed me down already. Job done. Isn't the system wonderful lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 LOL worked for me. In a way it's good, it slowed me down and perhaps if I hadn't been caught I'd have continued to speed around, and possibly do some damage to someone thru it. Unfortunately it doesn't work on everyone, nor can they actually catch everyone, but a few people have died in my town this year that had cars been going slower, wouldn't have died. Young people, with lives ahead of them. Gone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsteve Posted November 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 It always shocks me that approx 10 people die on average on British roads every day. And no-one seems to be doing much about it. Probably because you don't hear about it, unless there is a multiple on a motorway. If that many people died on the railways every day, there would be an outcry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Well last week someone murdered a baby just up the road from me, it hasn't even been on the news. In fact it's so shocking people wont even gossip about it, but if it's happened here it happens everywhere. The news is mental, they SHOULD tell us about road deaths, rapes, attempted abductions... all these things that happen every week. It's amazing but some people still think that nothing bad happens near them, or to them. What gets me with the news is an horrific story can be broadcast on a Monday and by Friday they never mention it again, no updates nothing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsteve Posted November 10, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 There's one news story that just runs and runs and runs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 10, 2008 Report Share Posted November 10, 2008 Exactly when what I wanna know is why did that baby die? Who is gonna do anything about stopping this sort of thing happening again? They have nothing to report because it'll just be accepted as part of life and forgotten about by Joe Public. Then no one will have to do anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aza Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 (edited) I know the feeling Steve, mate. I have had 'near misses' a few times now and boy does it put you on a right downer. I had a scenario very similar to what you mentioned before too. I did a bit of research on it before and basically they have 14 days to issue you with a notice of intended prosecution (NIP). So essentially, you should hear something in the next two weeks, although three weeks is best to be certain. The letter can be posted out on the 14th day so that would take you into the third week. At that sort of speed, it would be harsh to get done. I know people who have done more than 10mph on roads that should have higher speed limits. Once they saw the van, they actually stopped and went up to the van, asked the officer "have I got done" and the answer was no, but only because there were a shed of people doing much higher speeds. With vans, I think a certain amount of officer discression is involved. If you do get it, I think I have a link that helps (will post later), which basically advised you to complain, and rinse the system out of letter of appeals etc, which can hopefully end up in their backlog and forgetting about it! Edited November 11, 2008 by A2a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aza Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 Steve Some stuff I've kept from when I did a bit of research before... o I have recently been flashed by a Gatso camera, what happens next? The Police have 14 days to send you a Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP). They also get an allowance of a couple of days for the post to deliver it. So if its more than 17days since you were flashed they are too late to prosecute you, unless you were driving a company car, hire car or someone elses car. In these circumstances they are allowed more time to track you down. See below for further details. o If you know that you broke the speed limit and its inside the "14" day rule, then its easier to accept the offer of a £60 fine and 3 points. If you feel strongly enough about the abuse of Gatso's as revenue generating tools - rather than safety tools - then you could go to court. If enough people did this then it would totally clog up the system and it would fall over - however being British and too reserved - this is unlikely to happen. If you already have points on your licence and the points from this will take you to 12 points or more, then you could get banned and we would suggest that you take legal advice to prevent/mitigate this. o The Notice of Intended Prosecution (NIP) arrived outside of the "14" day period. You should be able to get the prosecution dropped - get our lawyers to write you a legal letter and it should go away. This is assuming that you are the registered owner of the vehicle. o I have received a NIP, but some information on it is incorrect. If there is a typographical error on the Notice of Intended Prosecution in relation to a persons name or address for example then the NIP is deemed valid and the Prosecution will be entitled (with no costs penalty to them) to make an application at the hearing of the summons to amend the NIP under what is called "the Slip Rule". Permission will always be granted where there is no detriment to the Defendant. In other words where it is admitted that the offence alleged took place or where the Court find that the offence was committed not withstanding the Defendants plea of not guilty. If there is a more fundamental breach e.g. the registration number is incorrect then the alleged Defendant need only complete the s172 Notice attached to the NIP stating that he is not in fact the owner of the vehicle whose registration number is shown on the Notice. o I am being accused of speeding, but the Police did not calibrate the device properly. Failure to follow APCO or manufacturers rules on calibration/re-calibration will not make a prosecution invalid. What it will do however is give the defendant excellent grounds for pleading not guilty and thereby forcing the police to prove their case beyond reasonable doubt. Where they have failed to meet the standards prescribed by the manufacturers (not necessarily APCO as those recommendations are good practice only) it would be relatively easy under cross-examination, to cast doubt on the prosecution evidence thereby forcing the bench to return a not guilty verdict. o What are the guidelines on speed that decide whether you get a fixed penalty or a summons. The current guidelines from the Association of Chief Police officers (ACPO) are: Limit Fixed Penalty Summons 20 mph 25 mph 35 mph 30 mph 35 mph 50 mph 40 mph 46 mph 66 mph 50 mph 57 mph 76 mph 60 mph 68 mph 86 mph 70 mph 79 mph 96 mph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wakey Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 I do know people that have been done previously for doing 33 in a 30 zone. Harsh as! Just be careful out there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aza Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 You can get done at 33 with Gatsos - 10% margain of error? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissie Brown Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 I've also had a couple of near misses when the camera has flashed but l didn't hear anything so there may not have been any film in the camera or l wasn't going fast enough to warrent a fine. they were both on roads were roadworks were being carried out. One was in Southampton when l was going over a bridge, the speed limit signs had suddenly changed from 30 MPH to 20MPH and l hadn't noticed. The other incident was in Chiswick, London and the camera went off but l couldn't see any warnings. Fortunately l was in luck and nothing came of it but the points can soon add up. Good luck Steve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 I sometimes think if someone says they were done for doing 33 in a 30 they are fibbing, not necessarily an out and out Lie they may well have thought they were only a tad over the limit, but surely no one gets done for that. Needless to say the max speed is 30 in a 30 and 30 is the max you should do in good driving conditions so if it's wet, dark, foggy, icy, extremely bright low sunshine, any other hazards you should be doing LESS than 30. It's not a target speed, as some people seem to think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aza Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 Unless it's one of these signs : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 11, 2008 Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 LOLOL which lets face it IT usually isn't! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsteve Posted November 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Aza, thanks very much for the info. Its very useful knowing that if I haven't heard within 17 days I can forgot about it. Another Q you might be able to help with: The section of road in question isn't signed as being a 'Camera Zone.' (ie, there's none of those silly little pictures of Victorian Cameras) However, the 'Safety Camera' van did have them on it, but you can't see them until its too late. Surely they wouldn't be able to issue a ticket in this case? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aza Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Yeah, know what you mean, and that did used to be the case... Gatso cameras in the UK previously had deployment requirements, in common with all fixed speed camera types operated in the UK by Safety Camera Partnerships (SCPs) under the National Safety Camera Programme (NSCP). They had to be marked, made visible, located in places with a history of serious accidents, and where there was evidence of a speeding problem, or where was a local community concern. Since April 2007 however, such requirements have been removed. It is still recommended that cameras be made visible and roads with fixed ones, clearly signed, but they can now be placed at any location, regardless of its crash history. Cameras operated solely by the Police, outside of the NSCP schemes, do not need to comply with visibility requirements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsteve Posted November 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Boo...that's that loophole closed then Thanks again for the info mate - much appreciated :winkthumbsup: If I get a ticket, no doubt I'll come back to this thread and vent my anger, but if you don't hear from me in about 2 weeks time, I'll have escaped! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 That's a stupid bloody idea anyway. Something that can catch you doing something wrong is only allowed to catch you if you're warned about it in advance!!! WTF! But then again how stupid would you have to be to get caught by a secret camera that was as much a secret as Obama being black! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsteve Posted November 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Almost as stupid as I was on the morning in question. I was thinking about whether I had been caught or not, that I nearly got flashed further down the road by a fixed camera that I knew was there! I had to brake heavily, almost causing an accident, to avoid getting a potential 2nd ticket! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 I know, why don't you observe the actual speed limit and not worry about whether there are any cameras anymore! Problem solved! I'm kinda joking, but only kinda! Hope you don't get a ticket, they're expensive. Hope you don't do it again tho too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigsteve Posted November 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 I think I over-reacted on the 2nd camera and was actually doing 30mph, but hit the brakes as I didn't have time to check I was under the limit. Point taken tho :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number2Fan Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Love you really! XXX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aza Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 The old warning thing about Gatsos had to be there as I recall something about human rights / privacy etc. It was the old camera use in society, where it could be compared to having your photo taken in public without conset (I think). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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